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I was just reading the contenst for adaptagen, it says it includes DHEA... does that not make it a PH?

Technically yes. Adaptogen N does contain DHEA which is a prohormone.

The beauty here though, is its place in the formula. The big drivers are the legit Bulgarian Trib (1500 whopping mg/serving) and Eurycoma Longifolia (Longjax) in terms of test elevation. Melatonin too, believe it or not, has some research pointing to such.

Now the Trib largely drives an increase in leutinizing hormone, which signals the testes to make testosterone. They need raw substrate to do it though and that's where DHEA comes in.

Since DHEA is more or less starter material for test the Trib "influences" it's conversion to testosterone. Once coverted, it's in the bloodstream. And it is here where Longjax comes in..

Longjax as I see it in this formula is incorporated to make sure that test is biologically active "free" testosterone via its influence of serum hormone binding globulin (SHBG). There is some nice research supporting that too. There's even research it might convert to DHEA itself is needed.

The custom 25:1 Suma and melatonin are fine restoratives/regeneratives and Suma is a favored adaptogen and in fact, contains ecdy. Whatever the case, it's been around for something like 13 years for a reason.... man you can feel it. You wake up feeling refreshed, fully recovered (or at least very noticeably) and the sex drive is unreal.

I know there are TONS of test boosters out there. AN has so much to offer. It's not just a test booster, its an aphrodisiac, adaptogen and restorative/relaxation nutraceutical. Obviously, those are just my opinions. Which reminds me... I need to order more.

Just my $.02...

Not really, Buffer.

It's a quite moderate amount of the "master hormone" that's included as a key side bar "fuel" to the much, much higher mg's of herbal substrates.

It enhances the entire mix by design while not acting in any sort of suppressive way in regards to natural test production.

*added note*

I see that Rob beat me to the punch and explained it's role perfectly and in a good deal more detailed manner than I did....

He understands precisely the supporting role DHEA plays in the Adaptogen N formula.

does it list quantity of dhea anywhere?

Also, melatonin is usually taken at night. Is that the same for this or do you take it during the day?

the_buffer wrote:does it list quantity of dhea anywhere?

Also, melatonin is usually taken at night. Is that the same for this or do you take it during the day?

Adaptogen N is exclusively a before sleep formula, Buffer, and that is for very good reason.

Look into LH more and you'll start to see the connections.

There is 25mg of DHEA per cap.

how much caffeine is there per burn it up cap?

DaCookie wrote:how much caffeine is there per burn it up cap?

52mg, naturally extracted, thus the caffeine in BIU purposely does not have the "jarring" nervous/edgy effect that the same amount of synthetic caffeine would render for a lot of folks.

Most supplements pass off the cheap stuff for the more expensive one (products containing 100% naturally-occurring caffeine are more expensive to produce). There is no chemical difference between natural and synthetic caffeine, so an HPLC test can't even detect which is in a formula - but you can surely feel the difference.

This test will reveal it, however- https://bodybuildingsupplements.com/herbal_health ... ments.html

We are also of the strong belief that naturally sourced caffeine as found in Burn It Up has nutritive and performance values that are not present in the synthetics.

When I have read about prohormones, or said bad things about them, it has been generally things that bypass LH or even bypass the testes, like by going through the liver to become a steroid. If you look up prohormone on wikipedia, DHEA isn't listed.

If you look up DHEA, you find that it CAN be converted into elements that ARE listed as prohormones. In fact it says:

DHEA supplements are sometimes used as muscle-building or performance-enhancing drugs by athletes. However, a randomized placebo-controlled trial found that DHEA supplementation had no (statistically significant) effect on lean body mass, strength, or testosterone levels

Heck, that article says it takes two steps to change DHEA to testosterone.

So DHEA IS a prohormone in that it can be used to help make them, is close, and is considered a hormone in its own right, but isn't a prohormone in the legal sense, etc... with regard to the US ban, and I don't think has the same safety problems.

Steve

You're pretty much right on there Steve..

DHEA was left alone as a sort of compromise/experiment to the anti-aging crowd. These people have the real power to combat Washington, not lifters. Shame really we can't organize better.

I absolutely do think it brings value to the table, especially in the AN formula. You'll notice it's not an overwhelming mg amount either. Very strategic use/thought behind that dosage, and I'm convinced that if you took it out there would be a difference.

RobRegish wrote:You're pretty much right on there Steve..

DHEA was left alone as a sort of compromise/experiment to the anti-aging crowd. These people have the real power to combat Washington, not lifters. Shame really we can't organize better.

I absolutely do think it brings value to the table, especially in the AN formula. You'll notice it's not an overwhelming mg amount either. Very strategic use/thought behind that dosage, and I'm convinced that if you took it out there would be a difference.

Yeah, the studies said they only used DHEA. It is like putting more gas through a carburetor. If no more gas makes it to the cylinders, things won't run any better. The idea is obviously that the dhea will help feed the need created by more LH. And they did say dhea didn't create a SIGNIFICANT improvement. Maybe most just had enough DHEA or needed chemicals to feed their current needs.

Steve

It's in Adaptogen N for more than just the test side of things, but that is obviously part of the equation.

DaCookie wrote:how much caffeine is there per burn it up cap?

Cookie

Burn It Up isnt one of those stims that youll take and within 20 mins be bouncing around. BIUhas a smooth and gradual effect it is probably one of my favorite stim supps in general becuase i dont get the nervouse jitter. Just a smooth clean nootropic effect for me. I love it

Hank! wrote:

DaCookie wrote:how much caffeine is there per burn it up cap?

Cookie

Burn It Up isnt one of those stims that youll take and within 20 mins be bouncing around. BIUhas a smooth and gradual effect it is probably one of my favorite stim supps in general becuase i dont get the nervouse jitter. Just a smooth clean nootropic effect for me. I love it

Yeap I know.I really like the feeling 2 of these give you, but yeh when I do 2 instead of 1 I go on a bit of a high for awhile.But dont crash.

You know when I love to take my BIU's?

Before I write. They're an amazing nootropic like tool. I almost feel guilty though, given the adaptogens therein and not using them to "zone" for some new PR I'm gunning for.

It definately has a different feel to it, and certainly no crash...