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Hey guys,

I have an 14 yr old sick, terminal dog who needs (and deserves) so much care that skipping some training is unavoidable. It's round the clock care so my brains are also a little bit burnt...

I've been reading again recently that BCAA's and HMB help minimize muscle mass and strength loss when you can't work out. Am also thinking of doing addt'l Synthagen . Definitely doing AN any day I do get a chance to workout.

Any other supp recommendations?
Any dosage and time of day recommendations for all these?

Many thanks.

BrainDead

I wish I could offer some supp recommendations, but this isn't an area I've looked into much. Based on the intelligence behind your posts, you've probably already considered what I'm about to write, but here goes...you might try a low carb Paleo-ish diet when you know you won't be working out. Mark Sisson has reported muscle retention through workout slumps doing this. From personal experience, I can tell you that I feel much better on a higher fat, moderate protein, low carb diet and I'm leaning out from about 8 months over-indulgence really easily.

I'm currently consuming 25-30% P, 5% C, 65-70% F all from whole foods (free range eggs, grass fed beef, homemade bone broth, avocados, grass fed butter, extra virgin coconut oil, etc.). If you do attempt a diet this low you'll want to make sure you take 1/8-1/4 tsp of himalayan salt (or similar) for every 16oz of water you drink. If you don't, you may find yourself dehydrated. I take 4tsp of himalayan salt sole (~26% solution) every morning and at noon and use the salt to taste on/in my food/broth in the evenings. If consuming these macros for an extended amount if time, I also recommend fermented foods and using unmodified potato starch as a means of providing pro-/pre-biotics since they tend to be scarce with a high fat diet.

Full disclosure...my fasting glucose (prior to these macros) was at the high end of normal and my HDL/triglyceride ratio suggests that I'm insulin resistant. I also had high LDL and blood pressure, so my systemic inflammation was likely high. My point here is that I might be deriving more benefits from this way of eating than the average Joe.

I realize that this isn't exactly what you're looking for, but it's the best suggestion I can give. I'm sorry about you're dog and I hope you are able to revive his or her health. We lost a pet last week, so I know how emotional it can be.

BrainSquirts wrote:Hey guys,

I have an 14 yr old sick, terminal dog who needs (and deserves) so much care that skipping some training is unavoidable. It's round the clock care so my brains are also a little bit burnt...

I've been reading again recently that BCAA's and HMB help minimize muscle mass and strength loss when you can't work out. Am also thinking of doing addt'l Synthagen . Definitely doing AN any day I do get a chance to workout.

Any other supp recommendations?
Any dosage and time of day recommendations for all these?

Many thanks.

BrainDead

First as one dog owner to another, my heart goes out to you..

Having said that, HMB is beyond useless. See here as to why (interesting)!
https://bodybuildingsupplements.com/phpB ... php?t=2449

Secondly, MPS already contains BCAA's (and a whole lot more!). Supplemental BCAA's may prove useful between MPS dosages though. Most anti-catabolics are "passive", for lack of a better term. But I'd add Fearn Lecithin Granuals (2 tablespoons once a day), with or just before a high protein meal.

Adaptogen N as you correctly surmised. Kre-Anabolyn with meals or just prior is also a solid pick. Tranquilogen will help protect muscle breakdown, improve mood and do it caffeine free (which I know is important to you).

So MPS, Adaptogen N, BCAA's and Lecithin granuals. And oh, Convict Conditioning is the best book on bodyweight training (strength training in general), I've ever read!

Brain, you'd devour it...

Thanks, guys, for the valuable tips.

Turns out, at least for the last week or so, I can make/find time to workout... but since my sleep is so interrupted, recovery is compromised big time. I’m on the dog’s schedule. This means I workout on any day after I’ve had decent sleep and ‘hope’ for recovery.

Thicketman, re: “4tsp of himalayan” Why so much?
For ‘higher fat’ intake, have you considered nuts in the AM?

Rob and Ask,
Re: “HMB” I’ve been working with the presups that
1 HMB is anticatabolic , ( via inflammation reduction ? via immune support? ). Not anabolic.
2 some are better ‘responders’ that others (why?)
3 the older you are, the more potential anticatabolic benefit.
So, for most peeps, I would agree with Rob and Mass that HMB is ‘worthless’. I’m looking for times and doses to fit it in on a limited basis. I do know that if I couldn’t afford to try it on me, I certainly would be looking to spend my bucks elsewhere.

Rob, Re:

Secondly, MPS already contains BCAA's (and a whole lot more!). Supplemental BCAA's may prove useful between MPS dosages though. Most anti-catabolics are "passive", for lack of a better term. But I'd add Fearn Lecithin Granuals (2 tablespoons once a day), with or just before a high protein meal.
WHY? thx.
Adaptogen N as you correctly surmised. Kre-Anabolyn with meals or just prior is also a solid pick. Tranquilogen will help protect muscle breakdown, improve mood and do it caffeine free (which I know is important to you).

So MPS, Adaptogen N, BCAA's and Lecithin granuals.

Thanks, rob. Great stuff.
Bought a bottle of Tranquilogen for my daughter to ‘load’ prior to her taking MCATs in late April....maybe will steal it back and order her another one.

Btw I’m not really anti caffeine. I’m pro coffee (and tea) in the AM. But I’m anti any regular use of anhydrous caff anytime past 2 PM... I just don’t think it will pay off long term for anyone with a health first orientation... ie maybe useful for fanatic bb’s and competition prep - but will sooner or later slam a ‘cost’ onto the CNS,etc. ie help today, but damage the future... everyone has to do their own costs/ benefits analysis.

Re “Convict Conditioning” Rob, I promise you I’ll get a copy... however, I’m pretty well slanted towards Scott Sonnon’s training, compensation, and recovery model these days. ( ... he has far more ‘personality disorders’ than you, but sometimes he reminds me a little bit of you ... a prisoner of his own genius  )

That's four teaspoons of sole which has about one teaspoon worth of sodium. The body doesn't hold on to sodium well with a low carb diet. The kidneys dump it. Water has a tendency to follow sodium so dehydration is a potential issue. Sodium isn't the bad guy it's made out to be particularly on a low carb paleo type diet. Refined salt plus food additives may be a different story altogether.

Re: “HMB” I’ve been working with the presups that
1 HMB is anticatabolic , ( via inflammation reduction ? via immune support? ). Not anabolic.
2 some are better ‘responders’ that others (why?)
3 the older you are, the more potential anticatabolic benefit.
So, for most peeps, I would agree with Rob and Mass that HMB is ‘worthless’. I’m looking for times and doses to fit it in on a limited basis. I do know that if I couldn’t afford to try it on me, I certainly would be looking to spend my bucks elsewhere.

Understand man. I'd put good $ on MPS being a lot more beneficial tho (or even EAA's) doing you better..

Coach Rob wrote:Adaptogen N as you correctly surmised. Kre-Anabolyn with meals or just prior is also a solid pick. Tranquilogen will help protect muscle breakdown, improve mood and do it caffeine free (which I know is important to you).

So MPS, Adaptogen N, BCAA's and Lecithin granuals. And oh, Convict Conditioning is the best book on bodyweight training (strength training in general), I've ever read!

I'm in a similar situation right now. I can't train due to back injury, and I'm basically just restricted to laying around all day. Plus I've been eating lots due to boredom. So I'm getting fat, and have decided to diet down, but I'm worried I'll look starved at the end of it due to muscle loss from dieting with no training.

To help avoid that I'm going to supplement with MPS and Lecithin granuals as per your recommendation Rob... but I'm unclear about what you're saying here about Adaptogen N and Kre-Anabolyn and Tranquilogen. Are these only to be used when we get back to training? Or would they also help avoid muscle loss while dieting without training? And if so, which ones?

Also any timing/dosage guidance on all of the above would be great!