The Original Online BODYBUILDING SUPPLEMENTS FORUM. Advanced Techniques. Pro Tips & Insights. The Best Advice!

Well think about it, Costco, or Sams club has virtually no overhead costs in their buildings. Everything is bulk. The store is a warehouse that the customer picks from. I can buy 36 eggs for less than the cost of buying 12 at a normal grocer, I can get 4 lbs of name brand cottage cheese for less than a 12oz container at a normal store, at whole foods i pay 3.99/lb for bulk quinoa.. at Costco I pay 4.99 for 5 lbs...

I am not saying that Muscle Milk is the end all be all, but the flavor is really good, and judging it on price alone is not a good method to determine a flag in my opinion.

I really like all the input from you (John) and Rob with the scientific literature though. I am not putting down your analysis at all, I just felt that using price as a flag will not always signal low quality!

I forgot to mention that I use MASS PRO MVP (unflavored) in juice all the time and it's a great option to beat the "shake blues".

I'll juice an apple, celery, carrots and parsley and then toss in a scoop of MP MVP.

Very tasty.

VERY healthy.

sidenote about bulk stores

their prices on greek yogurt are NOT the best

Trader Joe's has had and still has the best dead of FFGY

0 grams of fat, 22 grams protein, 7 grams carbs per serving
four servings per tub @ 225grams each

4.99

sovabrat wrote:Well think about it, Costco, or Sams club has virtually no overhead costs in their buildings. Everything is bulk

Sorry Sova, but you are kidding yourself.

It would cost us around $70 EACH to have 5 pounders of MASS PRO produced... Before adding a small resell mark up to pay the bills.

They would wind up running about $100 in the indy stores that carry our stuff.

Not trying to beat you up, friend, but just pointing out the reality of the marketplace. And, I'm not here to pimp MASS PRO on you either, it sells itself... but, 5 pounds for $30 retail is a massive, massive red flag.

I'd rather see you use powdered milk, I'm afraid.

It would cost us around $70 EACH to have 5 pounders of MASS PRO produced... Before adding a small resell mark up to pay the bills.

I appreciate where you are coming from. But I just think the metrics we are using to compare are not very good. The two products are very different, similar to scion cars versus say a Bentley. They both are cars, they both get you from A to B, although in a different fashion. Price is not a good comparison of functionality.

I also think comparing masspro to muscle milk based on price is not straight forward either. Yes they could use cheaper ingredients, BUT, If they are making 10 million lbs of protein compared to 50,000 lbs, they would have economies of scale on production, they would have strong bargaining power with suppliers, they would have much cheaper distribution, they have retailers with demand for their product. Consider all the avenues of delivery they have: schools, gyms, grocery stores, airports, etc. They can take a much smaller margin and still come out way ahead.

So to use the logic that 5 lbs for 30 dollars is a red flag, and to extrapolate that to my point about cars, that is saying that these cars should not be driven, that they are inferior and people should be weary of them. I do not find that to be the case. (i know cars and protein are dissimilar, but the analogy works)

In summary, I have conceded to the point that MASSpro is a high quality protein, I know you do not pimp out your products, as you allow us to talk freely in these forums, and a lot of the time MASS is the best way to go, period. I just think in this instance the point you brought up had flaws to it, that's all.

I am still a big fan at the end of the day.

I tried a lot of protein supplement for the last 10 years or so. I don't buy cheap protein anymore; first because they don't digest/absorb/perform well, second because my budget allows me to get better stuff.

But paying a lot doesn't mean you get good protein: a bought progenex more muscle and recovery US$135, 1 kg bag each and it's a huge deception... And I payed for customs fees and international shipping too

Right now, the only two protein products that made the cut in my book are:

MassPro whey by Muscle And Sport Science
Warrior whey by Defense Nutrition

Both are cold process concentrate, both have lecithin, one have colostrum the other fibersol. Nothing else compares too those two as far as I am aware of. They both taste amazing, digest easily and helps recover for workouts.

Which one has lechithin? I am supplementing that with capsules right now, I think I got 200 softgels for 16 bucks? I cant remember, it was during my first BP run.

Sova, I get the impression you haven't studied up on MASS PRO.

My comparison was not based on price alone, hardly, but it did assume that a fairly good understanding of MASS PRO's many upsides vs. the very concerning downsides of the cheap ones was understood.

Just click and read the links I posted.

Big is right about a higher price not being a guarantee of better quality, too. Many of the higher priced brands come straight out of China, too. Slick ads, hyperbole and glossy labels do not a quality protein powder make.

Not going to beat you over the head with it, though. Read the linked pages on MASS PRO, or don't. Try it and see real recovery, real results, or don't.

I'm just saying that it is a complete impossibility to make a quality protein powder and retail it out at Costco or wherever for 5# @ 30 bucks.

We've been at this for a while.

Best to you, man.

Oh, and MASS PRO is Lecithin packed.

Accelerate fat loss, optimize energy, boost your brain...

MASS PRO is GMO Free Lecithin enhanced to accelerate fat loss, improve cellular recovery and boost energy. Lecithin emulsifies lipids and speeds fat metabolism. Medical studies show Lecithin's benefits to include; Lowered "bad" LDL cholesterol. Increased "good" HDL cholesterol. Improved cardiovascular function. Liver protection. Increased physical performance and brain/memory enhancement.

I've tried a whole lot of protein powders and I'm a huge fan of making a custom blend through true protein but I've got to say, I tried my Mass Pro sample and I am HOOKED. Once I'm through with the ~20 pounds of protein I have stored at home, I'll be picking up a case of Mass Pro.

askmass wrote: I'm just saying that it is a complete impossibility to make a quality protein powder and retail it out at Costco or wherever for 5# @ 30 bucks.

We've been at this for a while.

I did read about MassPRO, I even conceded the point that masspro is high quality. My argument was that price alone was not a good metric to compare qualities of protein and you are even agreeing to that. That is the end of my argument. I do not agree with your absolute statement though. I do think that if they were to copy your formula and ingredients, the price would rightfully be higher than $30, but I think it would cost significantly less than what you could produce it for.

I continue to be a fan, and still look forward to using MASSpro. It was never a question for me on if I wanted to use it or not.

I appreciate the friendship and open discussion, Sova.

Truth is, we are actually generally able to come in at a lower end price if one is comparing apples to apples because we don't have to pass along millions of dollars in advertising costs to the end consumer.

Generally, with our line, were the so-called majors to produce them you would see significantly higher retail prices than what we are able to deliver them at direct to consumer and without all the glitz and paid for hype.

The big companies as a rule are in it for the money. They seek to maximize profit margins, first and foremost. That is their business model, and high end formulations with expensive ingredients and costly production techniques do not fit the bill.

We could certainly produce junk whey and sell it dirt cheap to "compete" with those guys, but why in the world would we want to do that given our completely different business model, ethics and success?

We operate on earning repeat business and lifetime customers, and have been doing so since 1993 to real, paying customer amateur and pro athletes, sports and medical clinics/teams/schools/spas, weekend warriors and BP'ers alike.

We're real athletes, use our own products, and do legit research on performance, health and longevity. Marketing and profit margins are considered, because they have to be to stay in business, but not first and foremost by a long shot.

OK, nuff said by me!

Best to you, Sova, and everyone.

I'm off to bike 100k today, with Burn It Up fueling me along the way.

askmass wrote:
It would cost us around $70 EACH to have 5 pounders of MASS PRO produced... Before adding a small resell mark up to pay the bills.

Really John that isn't outrageous, brands which are generally to be considered premium proteins hover around the 65-80 mark for 5lbs.

Not endorsing any of these but to illustrate a point
Isoflex $65 5lbs
XF 2.0 $30 2lbs
Vasolate $30 2lbs
Magnum Quattro $75 5lbs

I have reached a point where I dont buy the costco stuff anymore, I didnt love the flavor and it did upset my stomach. There isnt a 100% correlation between price and qulality, but its pretty darn close with proteins.

I do use a utility whey that i buy in bulk, but i keep high quality stuff around for specific purpose

good luck on your ride.