Caloric Zig-Zags

aron7awol · Post by **aron7awol** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:49 am

My maintenance calories are about 2300 on non-workout days and 2800 on workout days. If I'm doing a caloric zig-zag from BP 3.0, say 120% of maintenance on training days and 100% on non-training days, do I take the exercise into account in calculating the 120%, or is that what the extra 20% is already doing?

On workout days:
2300 x 120%?
or
2800 x 120%?

Jacos5 · Post by **Jacos5** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:31 am

Seems like a really odd way to calculate your maitnance. Usually it's done with an overall maitnance. For instance the calculator I use just takes into account how much work I put in a week and gives me an overall maitnance. In that case you'd really only add the 20% on workout days.

The "Katch-McArdle Equation" seems to be one of the most respected equations. Consider looking into it.

dropthebeats · Post by **dropthebeats** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 8:18 am

You should have only one number for you maintenance calories. And with that number, you'll use the 120% or whatever % you need for each day.

One way you can figure out your maintenance calories is this:

Weigh yourself on Monday. Track every single thing you eat for the entire week. Weigh yourself again the next Monday at the exact same time, and the same scale. If you weigh that same, take your total calories for the week and divide by 7. That will give you your maintenance calories.

Each pound is 3500 calories. So say you gained 1 pound during that week and you consumed 14,000 calories. Since you gained you would subtract 3500 from the 14,000 and then divide that by 7. You do that because you were eating above maintenance.

You would do the opposite if you lost weight. If you lost 1 pound and consumed the same amount of calories, you would add 3500 calories to the 14,000 and divide that number by 7.

I hope that helps.

aron7awol · Post by **aron7awol** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 9:59 am

Thanks for the responses, guys. I'm surprised that you find the way I did it to be odd. I thought it made a lot of sense. I work from home, so on days that I don't exercise, I'm literally sedentary. I tried a few online calorie calculators to arrive at the 2300 number for those days. I use a calorie counting app on my phone to enter my foods, as well as any exercise that I get that day. It then adjusts my calorie number up according to how much I burned. I've been eating only my maintenance calories for the last few weeks, so I thought the above approach would keep me from eating more than my true maintenance during my non-workout days, and also keep me from eating less than my true maintenance on workout days.

So, I'll recalculate my maintenance calories using the Katch-McArdle Equation as Jacos suggested, and then I'll test it this week using the method dtb suggested. If I assume for now that my 2300/2800 numbers are correct, since I work out 3 times/week, that puts me at an average daily rate of 2514. In that case I could take 2 approaches with the 120%/100% split I used in my example:

1. Use my average baseline as you guys suggest
Workout days - 2514 * 1.2 = 3017
Non-workout days - 2514
This puts me at 3017/2800 = 7.8% above "true maintenance" for workout days and 2514/2300 = 9.3% above "true maintenance" for non-workout days.

2. Use my true maintenance values as I was thinking
Workout days - 2800 * 1.2 = 3360
Non-workout days - 2300
This puts me at 20% above "true maintenance" for workout days and exactly at "true maintenance" for non-workout days.

I guess I'm wondering what Rob had in mind when he created the caloric zig-zags in 3.0. Is it better to be consistently higher than maintenance calories, on both workout and non-workout days, or is it better to bulk on workout days only and maintain on non-workout days?

dropthebeats · Post by **dropthebeats** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:00 pm

Katch-McArdle Equation is pretty close. It will get you about, if not exactly, where you need to be. And you do have to go a whole week of testing.

aron7awol · Post by **aron7awol** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 4:55 pm

dropthebeats wrote:Katch-McArdle Equation is pretty close. It will get you about, if not exactly, where you need to be. And you do have to go a whole week of testing.

It has me at 2330 at sedentary, so that's almost exactly what I was using on my non-workout days for my true maintenance.

aron7awol · Post by **aron7awol** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:30 pm

I could be wrong, but the more I think about this the more I think that setting a daily caloric value based on whether that day actually contains a workout seems like it might be more optimal than using a weekly baseline and going from there.

I think a cutting zig-zag is a better example. If I use a 2514 average again (based on 3 workout days at 2800 and 4 workout days at 2300) and I'm doing a 100/70 cutting zig-zag, that puts me at 2514 on workout days and 1760 on non-workout days:

Workout days: 1760 calories consumed - 2300 calories burned = -540
Non-workout days: 2514 calories consumed - 2800 calories burned = -286

Or using "true maintenance":

Workout days: 2800 calories consumed - 2800 calories burned = 0
Non-workout days: 2300*.7 = 1610 calories consumed - 2300 calories burned = -690

Rob: Based on your experience, which of these two approaches do you think is more optimal? I don't care about the added complication of calculating and tracking the calories; I'll gladly do it if it's a more optimal approach.

chameleon · Post by **chameleon** » Tue May 22, 2012 11:04 pm

This is a great question aron7awol, and is exactly what I was questioning in formulating my calories for 3.0.

Rob, could you comment on what maintenance calories you are using in 3.0 calculations: workout days, off-days, or weekly average? Thanks.

aron7awol · Post by **aron7awol** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:20 am

chameleon wrote:This is a great question aron7awol, and is exactly what I was questioning in formulating my calories for 3.0.

Rob, could you comment on what maintenance calories you are using in 3.0 calculations: workout days, off-days, or weekly average? Thanks.

I can answer this question for Rob, because I talked to him about it when this question came up...

The 3.0 caloric zig-zags are based on a weekly average. If you want to take it a step further and calculate a true maintenance figure on a daily basis, you can do something similar to what I'm doing in my BP run. Take a look at my log in the Journals forums, it's called The Precision Blueprint.

chameleon · Post by **chameleon** » Wed May 23, 2012 7:07 am

Thanks for your response aron7awol. I'll check out your log. I'm currently in famine, and will be putting up an introductory post soon.

Ariel · Post by **Ariel** » Tue Aug 07, 2012 4:51 am

I will recalculate my servicing calorie consumption using the Katch-McArdle Formula as Jacos recommended, and then I'll analyze it this weeks time using the technique dtb recommended. If I believe for now that my 2300/2800 figures are appropriate, since I perform out 3 times/week, that places me at a typical everyday amount of 2514.